StanF South Bend 9A Rebuild Thread

[StanF]

Edit: I decided to turn this into a regular rebuild thread, since that's where I'm heading.

This will replace an imported 9x20 lathe that I've owned for several years. The big draw of this lathe was the included taper attachment, which is complete, but not shown in the pictures below. I am also very happy to get power cross feed in the 9A - a feature missing from the 9x20 import.

South Bend 9A built in 1945:

It came with an Aloris knock off toolpost, but I had to fit it to the lathe.


Short video of the first cut I made:

Mount SB 9A to Mobile Bench?

I know many of you will hate this...I'm not thrilled either!

I was thinking about mounting my 9A to something like this HF Mobile Bench:
https://www.harborfreight.com/tool-...-cabinet-with-solid-wood-top-white-57439.html

I need to make it portable, and this would be quick and easy. The extra storage underneath would also be handy for storing the lathe tooling and turning rounds. The height of this HF bench would be okay for me, but might be 1-2" too tall from the ideal height.

I'd mount some kind of chip pan on it (automotive steel drip pan), and probably also fab up a steel back panel to help control the chips.

 

[rklopp]

We had our 48" 9A on a flimsy steel bench with the bolts loose for years and it worked OK. Your setup would probably be stiffer, especially if you put a decently hefty additional top layer over the wood.

 

[BrandonCarriveau]

I have a similar lathe and have mounted mine to a similar bench top. While the height isn't ideal it works fine.

 

[jim rozen]

Having it a bit too tall is probably OK. Your main problem will be the depth of the bench, to fit the rear drive unit. You may need to extend the top to the rear to support that.

 

[StanF]

Having it a bit too tall is probably OK. Your main problem will be the depth of the bench, to fit the rear drive unit. You may need to extend the top to the rear to support that.

Yes, good thought - the single rear bolt on the rear drive unit would need an extended top. The other two on the drive unit should be okay

 

[jim rozen]

Not sure how solid the wood top on that cabinet is - Rather than extending it you might consider replacing it with a deeper (wider) top that extends to the front and rear of the cabinet. Avoid the temptation to shorten the belt a lot, that would reduce the ability to transmit power to some degree.

 

[neanderthal mach]

There slightly shorter in length than your picture Stan, but I use 2 of something much the same bolted together side by side under my non SB 11" swing lathe. Each of mine measure out to about 18.5" deep and 28" wide. But the castors are removed. I bought them and knew ahead of time I'd be doing exactly that for very good and logical reasons. Even then, the lathes spindle C/L is a bit high. But get a bit older and having it closer to your eyes is for me helpful. In fact I now like the height better than the more usual recommended carriage hand wheel elevation at roughly around elbow height.

I'd say fully loaded with lathe and some mill tooling along with the lathe on top, I'm looking at well over 1500 lbs. Rolling it around, these boxes are going to twist as the castors conform to what ever elevation differences there on on your floor. If it were me, I'd sure be rethinking the idea. And I'd go through a whole lot of shop reorganization, time, money and effort to never put any lathe on castors or wheels. My first lathe was a little 5" swing mounted to a 1" thick x 12" wide X 28" long steel plate. Any temperature and humidity changes would affect the benches wooden structure under the lathe more than enough to bend and twist that steel plate and of course the lathe bed above it. So that box without question is going to do the same. For the more bench top sized lathes, I think these mechanics rollaway's can work very well. Ample and protected storage for tooling, there fairly rigid and don't change every time the humidity moves a few points. But rolling mechanics tools around is a whole lot different than bolting a lathe down to it that's hopefully been set up with some precision so it does turn and bore parallel.

I also laminated a couple of layers of 3/4" thick MDF as a bench top in whatever size would work for you as Jim just mentioned. While MDF isn't 100% immune to humidity changes, it does slow it down with all that glue in it. I still put 3 coats of marine paint on bench tops bottom surface and used standard laminate on all the edges and top. So I don't see much measurable change in it either. If I could afford it, I'd use heavy steel plate instead as it makes a massive difference in stiffening up the whole lathe bed. Casting your own concrete bench top might be even better and just like SB recommended during WW II.

 

[M.B. Naegle]

I wanted my SB 9A to be mobile as well, but to a different degree. Not so much on wheels but such that the stand could become a crate for storage or transport, but I built it to be as compact as possible without anything hanging out past the base (and making it easy to snag and break off). I don't have the dimensions in front of me and can measure it later when I'm home, but I think to came out to something like 36" deep and 42" wide?

South Bend 9" Thread

Replacing the top on that rolling tool box might work, but I'd be afraid of it tipping over. If I was putting one on wheels, I'd start with a deeper bench with solid legs. Make it such that you can level it off of the casters so it doesn't move when you don't want it too, and if you want to put a tool box under it keep that as a separate unit or build it in, but just have the top supported by more than thin sheet metal corners. I don't know that I'd trust most of today's commodity tool box frames to the job. It's a 9" South Bend, and IMO I don't think it needs a 1000lb. base or the other stuff guys come up with to make it more "rigid", but it does need to be solid enough that the stand won't flex or move on you.

If you don't mind having parts of the machine hanging past the base, there was another member on here who had one his dad made from wood that looked pretty sharp while being compact yet stable. Mcleod I think? Haven't seen him posting and can't find that name searching.....

I'll add too that I'm not a fan of putting machines on wheels. I get that space is limited and you want to maximize it as much as you can, but with all the drawbacks of having casters under a machine like this (lack of stability, frame flexing and loosing level, etc.), I think you're better off planning out the shop so the machines can stay put, while also being comfortable and competent moving them when you must. We used to keep mills and lathes on 4x4 beams to make moving them with pallet jacks easier, and that added height wasn't helpful IMO. I for one have been much happier having the machine down at the factory height, as there's better visibility, less stuff around the base to trip you, and less pockets for dirt and dropped parts to get lost in, and once you know how to use a jack and a pinch bar it really doesn't take that much extra time or effort to do so.

 

[dalmatiangirl61]

The US General tool boxes are sturdier, and I think deeper than the Yukon boxes, cost a bit more, but well worth it. I bought one of the USG boxes, it was cheaper than any of the old name brand boxes I could find used, would like to get more of them.

 

[StanF]

The US General tool boxes are sturdier, and I think deeper than the Yukon boxes, cost a bit more, but well worth it. I bought one of the USG boxes, it was cheaper than any of the old name brand boxes I could find used, would like to get more of them.

Thanks everyone for all the replies.

The US General box is about 4-5" taller than the Yukon, and also more expensive. So it has a couple of large drawbacks. One thing that I do not like about the Yukon box is that it's drawers are all pretty deep top to bottom, so there aren't many of them. I'd prefer having a couple of shallow drawers. The deep drawers won't be efficient for much of my tooling. Of course, the limited # of drawers is one reason why the Yukon is cheaper!

Longer term, I could weld up a solid frame and outboard the casters to lower the tool box and lathe height. And outboard leveling feet to level up the lathe and make it more solid. I could do this immediately, but like all of us, I have a long string of projects in the queue.

I've got an unlimited 25% off coupon from HF that I can use on a tool box, so I'll have to decide in the next 2-3 days!

 

[SteveM]

As the drive unit is completely independent of the lathe, you could make a separate mounting plate that attaches to the top and hangs off the back, supported by arms that run down to the bottom of the rear of the cabinet.

Steve

 

[StanF]

I'm currently planning the rest of the rebuild - two questions are below.

Current Status...the lathe seems to be original, complete, and fully functional. But I have only run it for a few seconds - just to test everything - because of concerns about proper lubrication.

One potential issue...i does seem that the tail stock is way below the head stock - about .020", so I'll want to address that. I just did a quick check with MT3 and MT2 dead centers. I'll check more carefully again later.

Rebuild...I've bought the felt kit and a new cross feed nut from eBay sources. And I picked up the Rebuild Book too.


9A kit:

I have the taper attachment:

There's a ton of information on rebuilding, so thanks to everyone who documented their work before me!

A couple of questions...
First, has anyone rebuilt their lathe and NOT painted it?
My plan is to keep and use the lathe - I'm not trying to beautify it for resale. I love seeing the beautiful lathes that are fully painted, but (1) it's time-consuming and (2) I kind of like the old patina look. There's a good chance that I'll regret it later, if I don't paint it while I have it apart.

If I was going to paint it, there's some great info on Sherwin-Williams paint that I will follow. I like the original greenish gray color.

Second,it still has the original GE motor, which is fully operational. But would it be worth replacing it with a TEFC motor while I've got it apart? Open frame motors and metal chips seem like a bad combination. Or possibly fab up some kind of chip shield?

Edit: I would add that the existing motor has sleeve bearings with oilers. I've lubed it, but with the motor on its side, I'm not sure where the oil is going.

 

[jim rozen]

By re-build you are discussing cleaning, repairing broken parts, upgrading the lubrication issues to as-new. Also adjust the spindle bearings and so on. A new crossfeed nut will help but the crossfeed screw is probably worn near the center so if you want to help that see about replaceing the acme portion of the screw as well. Probably the lash on the dial/bushing could use a tweak as well. None of these constitute a 'full rebuild" but will go a long way to making the machine more useable.

The tailstock will be low, and the axis will be pointing down, this is how they wear. The quick fix is to place brass shim between the upper and lower sections. May the real machine tool rebuilders please forgive me....

Your motor has lasted that long so unless you really want to spend money then be sure the wiring is safe and go with that. If you really want to spend money get a small 3 phase motor to power with an inexpensive (teco) VFD. That will make the machine even more useable. The cost differential between a new TEFC motor, and a three phase one plus VFD is pretty small.

 

[4GSR]

Way back in the late 1960's dad bought one of those mobile tool carts from Grainger and mounted the 9" SBL to it. He always left the bolts loose on the bed on the tailstock end. Used it that way for several years until he built a HD wooden bench to put it on so he could take the mobile bench to work.
I'm wanting to mount it to one of the roll a ways someday. I have been looking at two, both are sold at HD. One is badged Milwaukee, and the other is a Husky brand. I haven't ruled out HF either as we already have two from there in the shop.

 

[plastikdreams]

Edit: I decided to turn this into a regular rebuild thread, since that's where I'm heading.

This will replace an imported 9x20 lathe that I've owned for several years. The big draw of this lathe was the included taper attachment, which is complete, but not shown in the pictures below. I am also very happy to get power cross feed in the 9A - a feature missing from the 9x20 import.

South Bend 9A built in 1945:
View attachment 430767
It came with an Aloris knock off toolpost, but I had to fit it to the lathe.
View attachment 430768

Short video of the first cut I made:

Mount SB 9A to Mobile Bench?

I know many of you will hate this...I'm not thrilled either!

I was thinking about mounting my 9A to something like this HF Mobile Bench:
https://www.harborfreight.com/tool-...-cabinet-with-solid-wood-top-white-57439.html

I need to make it portable, and this would be quick and easy. The extra storage underneath would also be handy for storing the lathe tooling and turning rounds. The height of this HF bench would be okay for me, but might be 1-2" too tall from the ideal height.

I'd mount some kind of chip pan on it (automotive steel drip pan), and probably also fab up a steel back panel to help control the chips.



View attachment 429963

The lathe is a toy, that bench is probably more rigid than the lathe...have at it

 

[dalmatiangirl61]

Thanks everyone for all the replies.

The US General box is about 4-5" taller than the Yukon, and also more expensive. So it has a couple of large drawbacks. One thing that I do not like about the Yukon box is that it's drawers are all pretty deep top to bottom, so there aren't many of them. I'd prefer having a couple of shallow drawers. The deep drawers won't be efficient for much of my tooling. Of course, the limited # of drawers is one reason why the Yukon is cheaper!

Looked at the current offering of Yukon boxes, dang it, they changed. Mine only has 2 deep drawers at bottom (L&R), and the long deep drawer across the top, so it has more drawers than current model..

 

[jim rozen]

"The lathe is a toy..."

The one I had, had the war production board tag on it. That toy probably did some hard work helping to win a war.

 

[StanF]

I have been looking at two, both are sold at HD. One is badged Milwaukee, and the other is a Husky brand. I haven't ruled out HF either as we already have two from there in the shop.

I looked at the Milwaukee that you mentioned, and it has some nice features - I like the double drawers on top. Unfortunately, it is 41" tall, if we were looking at the same one - there's a link below to the one that I saw. That would be too tall for me to use without outboarding the casters with a welded frame. 41" height seems to be a very common dimension for the tool box bases.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwauk...orkbench-Cabinet-48-22-8559/317342131#overlay

I went and looked at the HF Yukon box last night, and quickly realized that it is only 18" wide. That was disappointing. I shouldn't have overlooked that important dimension! It's still the most cost-effective unit that I can buy, but I would have to fab up a frame. I would not feel comfortable with the lathe weight on an 18" wide base. Still looking!

 

[4GSR]

I looked at the Milwaukee that you mentioned, and it has some nice features - I like the double drawers on top. Unfortunately, it is 41" tall. That would be too tall for me to use without outboarding the casters with a welded frame. 41" height seems to be a very common dimension for the tool box bases.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwauk...orkbench-Cabinet-48-22-8559/317342131#overlay
.............

Take the wheels off. That's what I'm going to do. The wheels won't do me any good for where it is going to go in my shop.
Go to have the wheels?
Another option as we did when I was little, dad put two Coke bottle pallets upside down on the floor for us to stand on while running the lathe. Who has a couple of those laying around?

 

[StanF]

I found a Husky that is 46" x 24.5" that is pretty affordable and close by. It'll cost more than the HF Yukon, but it's worth paying more, if it will work well. There aren't many left in my area, so I'll have to grab a white one, if any. White isn't my first choice, but I can live with it. I'll check it out tonight!






Interesting side note, in the 46" long x 18" wide x ~37" tall mobile workbench segment, the same box seems to be available from Home Depot (Husky), Lowes (Kobalt) and Harbor Freight (Yukon). There may be slight differences, but they look pretty darn similar! The prices vary quite a bit too between the 3 vendors, especially among the different paint colors.